personal fund. The prison uses the profits that they make from such articles sold for recreation activities for the prisoners." It so happened that before going to the prison the union officials in Keokuk asked me what I was going to do in the afternoon. I told them that I thought that since I had some time I would go over to see Carter and get some information on a particular case I was working on. Anthony Rader, Secretary of the Keokuk Trades and Labor Assembly, asked me if it would be all right with me if he rode over with me to Fort Madison because he also would like to see Mr. Carter. I told him that it was perfectly all right with me and he did ride over with me. On the way back to Keokuk from the prison Mr. Anthony Rader told me that he had received a letter from Mr. A. E. Hubbard, a movie operator and also Business Agent for the Truck Drivers' Union in Clinton, Iowa, that he was heading up a Defense Committee and was requesting funds which were to be used to gain Carter's pardon. After having dinner about 6:00 P. M. in the evening with Mr. Rader, Mr. Rader said to me, "I would like to have you come up to our assembly meeting tonight and give them a little talk." I accepted that invitation. About 9:00 o'clock in the evening the chairman of the meeting asked me if I would talk to the group and tell them about my visit with Mr. Carter because they were very much interested in what was happening. I got up and prefaced my remarks with the following statement: "Fellows, you all know that I am an Examiner with the National Labor Relations Board, but I wish to tell you at this time that any remarks that I make I do not make as a representative of a governmental agency, I make them only as a private citizen who has known Mr. Carter and has had some dealings with him, and I further want you to know that I am not doing this on government time because after working hours I spend my time as I see fit and I don't want any remarks that I make to be classified as having the Board's approval." I then went on to relate that after having discussed the business that I had with Mr. Carter that he had revealed to me something that I had not known before that prisoners had to purchase certain things from their personal funds and in case the prisoners did not have any funds they had to go without and I told them, that upon asking Carter if I sent him a carton of cigarettes would he get them and then I went on to tell them that rather than have cigarettes he would rather have the money to buy the commodities that the prison does not furnish the prisoners. I remember distinctly that I did say that I was quite sure that Mr. Carter would appreciate any small sums which he could use to purchase things for his food such as salt, pepper, butter and the like and then went on to state that although I did not know all the facts of the case that if what was told me by various persons were true then it seemed to me that he had been framed and I felt sorry that a man had to spend a good share of his life like that in prison. At the end of my talk the chairman of the assembly requested that the recording secretary read the correspondence that they had received since the last meeting and the recording secretary then read all correspondence. One of the letters that he read was A. E. Hubbard's letter, previously mentioned, to Mr. Rader about the gathering of funds for the use of securing Carter's pardon. Immediately after the correspondence had been read the chair of the assembly, as well as the secretary of the assembly, made talks regarding the letter that they had received from A. E. Hubbard and urged that each and every person who was present there should instruct their unions to forward funds to Mr. A. E. Hubbard in order that they might start the wheels moving to secure Carter's pardon. Later a person told me that he thought by the remarks that I made that Carter had been framed that I had made a slur on the State police and I immediately corrected him and told him that I had no intention of making any slur about any government agency because I realize that I did not have all the facts and therefore, could not denounce any government agency and that it was not my intention and in case anyone thought so, I wish to apologize for not having explained myself adequately. I wish further to state that that was the only time that I have ever made any remarks about Mr. Carter at any gathering. I realize that it would be doing wrong to be traveling around making campaign speeches for his pardon on government time. I did not think that after I had prefaced my remarks the way that I did that anyone would censure me for making any such remarks as a private citizen and on my own time, but if that was an error, I am sorry and I assure you that henceforth I will decline to make any remarks unless it is pertaining strictly to the National Labor Relations Act. Might I suggest that you contact the various individuals that were at the assembly meeting and particularly the officials of the Keokuk Trades and Labor Assembly and determine for yourself whether or not I have given you a clear picture. Unfortunately no stenographic records were made of what I said, but to the best of my recollection I can truthfully say that was said what I have already remarked above. I am sorry to have caused you any trouble. In case you want any further details, just let me know. As ever, The covering letter reads (Exhibit No. 1371): (Signed) H. VOGT. Under date of December 1, you asked me to investigate a matter raised by J. E. Hoover relating to Mr. Vogt. On December 5, Mr. Vogt and I were in Keokuk and there I interviewed Mr. George Dunn Weiny, President, C. D. Daily, Secretary, and A. W. Rader, Organizer for the Keokuk Trades and Labor Assembly. It was at a regular meeting of that Assembly on October 9, 1939 at which the alleged remarks were made. As you will note from Mr. Vogt's detailed report, he never addressed any other gathering on this subject. The enclosed affidavits from the Keokuk Assembly officials and memorandum from Mr. Vogt will, I believe, give you a broader and clearer picture of the incident than you would get from any report which I might write, and I am therefore sending them to you. Sincerely, (Signed) R. J. W. I offer in evidence a copy of a letter from Mr. Rader to Mr. Wiener, an affidavit from Mr. Rader, and an affidavit from George Weiny, and a copy of a letter from Mr. Witt to Mr. Weiny. (Reading Exhibit No. 1372:) The Board has considered your memorandum of December 8, with the enclosed material. Although the Board is inclined to feel that Vogt did nothing improper in this instance, the Board does feel that the time has come to consider transferring Vogt away from your office. This feeling of the Board's is based principally on the fact that in a situation such as exists in the State of Iowa it may be a good thing to have a change in Field Examiners from time to time. Please let me have your reactions to this suggestion. The Board's present inclination is to transfer Vogt to the 9th Region, Cincinnati, where there presently exists a vacancy due to a resignation. NW: RLP. cc-Philip G. Phillips. The communication and affidavit I offer in evidence from Mr. Weiny reads as follows (Exhibit No. 1374): We the President and Recording Secretary of The Keokuk, Trades and Labor Assembly, George Dunn Weiny and C. D. Daily respectively, do hereby state that we were present at the Assembly meeting on or about October 9th, 1939 at which Mr. Herbert J. Vogt was a visitor, and that we did hear him make a short talk to the body, and that before he commenced to talk he made it known that he was not talking as a representative of the Government but as a citizen he would say a few words in regard to Archie Carter, a friend of his whom he had met in several cases and knew from that standpoint. He told of having been held over in Keokuk an extra day waiting for some communication or other, and that he had taken the opportunity while here to go to Ft. Madison, Iowa, where Archie Carter is in the penitentiary to get from him some information on a labor case that he had. Mr. A. W. Rader had accompanied him and while at the penitentiary Carter had told them that he could not have certain things unless they were provided for him out of personal funds, such as sugar, pepper, cream, etc. And we do hereby state that the only appeal for funds or aid of any sort made by Mr. Vogt was in behalf of Carter to purchase those things that were nearly necessities. And we do hereby state that he did NOT make an appeal to the Assembly to take action to try to get a pardon or parole for Carter, neither did he make any statement whatsoever against the Federal Bureau nor the State Bureau of Investigation. We also wish to state that on several occasions we have had dealings with Mr. Vogt and have at all times found him to be fair in his dealings. We wish also to state that appeals for aid for the pardon or parole of Archie Carter were made at the Assembly meeting that night, but they were made by the officers of the Assembly and not by Mr. Vogt. We the undersigned do hereby swear that the above statement is true to the best of our knowledge. (Signed) KEOKUK TRADES AND LABOR ASSEMBLY, Attested and sworn to before me on the 6th day of December 1939. (Signed) WILLIAM E. TOMLINSON, Notary Public. Whose office expires July 4, 1942. The affidavit by Mr. Rader is as follows: EXHIBIT No. 1373 I, A. W. Rader, being first duly sworn, do state on oath; that on October 9th, 1939, Mr. Herbert J. Vogt, Field Examiner for the National Labor Relations Board, 13th Region, was in Keokuk, Iowa, for the purpose of arranging a consent election among the employees of the Rubber Industries Division Dryden Rubber Company. Rubber Workers Union No. 22077, whom I represented having petitioned the Board for an Election. Mr. Vogt, Officials of the Company and myself had a conference regarding the Stipulations of Election Agreement. The local attorneys for the Company objected to some of the conditions the Union felt should be included. The General Manager of the Company agreed to submit these things to the Chicago Office, and the answer would be back about 10:00 A. M., October 10th, 1939. It was a little after noon when this conference was concluded and during lunch, which Mr. Vogt and I had together, the subject of Mr. Archie Carter, being in prison was talked about. Mr. Vogt and myself had worked with Mr. Carter on other labor cases in Clinton, Iowa, and knew him very well. I suggested that in view of the fact our work was at a standstill until next morning we run up to Ft. Madison (a distance of 25 miles), and see Carter. Mr. Vogt said he needed to get some information from Mr. Carter about another case he was working on, so we visited Mr. Carter. Returning from Ft. Madison and during dinner, I gave Mr. Vogt a letter to read that I had received from Mr. Hubbard of Clinton, Iowa; in this letter Mr. Hubbard asked that any organization that was able, donate any funds they could for attorney fees for Mr. Carter. I also invited Mr. Vogt to attend our Assembly meeting which was that night and describe our meeting and talk with Mr. Carter. Mr. Vogt agreed to do so. I was not in the room at the beginning of Mr. Vogt's talk, being called to another room in the Assembly, but I was there when Mr. Vogt made this statement as we were taking leave of Mr. Carter, Mr. Vogt asked him [Carter] if we could send him some cigarettes. Mr. Carter replied that he had quit smoking and that if anyone wanted to send him anything to send money as he was forced to buy sugar, butter, etc. Mr. Vogt stated "I know Mr. Carter will appreciate anything done for him." Immediately after Mr. Vogt's talk, the letter from Mr. Hubbard was read, Mr. C. D. Daily, Acting Secretary, Mr. G. D. Weiny, Chairman and myself did ask that any organization represented, who were financially able, send whatever money they could to help Mr. Carter. (Signed) A. W. RADER. Subscribed and sworn to before me on this Seventh day of December A. D. 1939. (Signed) J. A. CONCANNON, Judge Superior Court at Keokuk, Iowa. Mr. ROBERT J. WEINER, EXHIBIT No. 1375 DECEMBER 7, 1939. Regional Director, National Labor Relations Board, New Post Office Building, Minneapolis, Minnesota. DEAR MR. WEINER: I am enclosing a notarized statement regarding the activities of Mr. Herbert J. Vogt, Field Examiner, on the day and evening of October 9th, 1939. As Mr. Vogt and myself spent the entire day and evening together, I feel qualified to speak of his activities on the day in question. Looking back on the events of that evening, I can readily see how any one could think Mr. Vogt did solicit funds for Mr. Carter. Immediately after Mr. Vogt's talk, a letter was read from Mr. Hubbard, of Clinton, Iowa, asking for any donation that any organization felt able to give. At the conclusion of this letter two other members and myself did ask for donations and further moved that the Assembly make a donation to this cause, which motion was carried. This is a matter of record on the minutes of that meeting. I can see where it would be very easy for anyone to connect these events. Mr. Vogt did not solicit any funds for Mr. Carter in this meeting. Very truly yours, I offer these documents in evidence. (Signed) A. W. RADER, Secretary. (Copy of communication dated December 8, 1939, from Robert Wiener to Nathan Witt, with memorandum attached, dated December 11, marked Confidential, was received in evidence, marked "Exhibit No. 1371," and appears above.) (Copy of communication dated December 22, 1939, from Nathan Witt to Robert J. Wiener, was received in evidence, marked "Exhibit No. 1372," and appears above.) (Affidavit by Mr. Rader, dated December 7, 1939, was received in evidence, marked "Exhibit No. 1373," and appears above.) (Affidavit by George Dunn Weiny and C. D. Daily of the Keokuk Trades and Labor Assembly, dated December 6, 1939, was received in evidence, marked "Exhibit No. 1374," and appears above.) (Communication from A. W. Rader to Robert J. Weiner, dated December 7, 1939, was received in evidence, marked "Exhibit No. 1375," and appears above.) Mr. TOLAND. Has it been your practice during the performance of your duties to make speeches at union meetings? Mr. VOGT. When requested, I made talks about the National Labor Relations Board; yes. Mr. TOLAND. How many times would you say that you addressed union organizations? Mr. VOGT. Well, that is difficult to state. I wouldn't know. Mr. TOLAND. Have you ever made any speech in behalf of the C. I. O.? Mr. VOGT. On behalf of the C. I. O.? Mr. TOLAND. Yes. Mr. VOGT. No; not in behalf of them. I have made an address to the C. I. O. State convention, but it was not in behalf of the C. I. O. Mr. TOLAND. Have you ever made any speech with the following statement made by you? (Reading :) One of the things that has amazed all of us who are assisting in Labor and the Labor Movement has been the rapid and phenomenal growth of the Congress of Industrial Organization in the past two years. Mr. VOGT. Do you have any document which will refresh my recollection? Mr. TOLAND. I am asking you now if you ever made that statement. The CHAIRMAN. Well, if you have a document and the witness wants to refresh his recollection, he may do so. Mr. TOLAND. Well, I will offer in evidence proceedings of the Second Constitutional Convention of the Iowa-Nebraska States Industrial Union Council, and I show you page 71, and ask you if that isn't the speech that you made at that convention? Mr. MURDOCK. I think you just offer it— Mr. TOLAND (interposing). I offer it in evidence. Mr. MURDOCK. Instead of introducing it, you now offer it. Mr. TOLAND. Yes. Mr. VOGT. Yes; I made this speech at the second convention. Mr. TOLAND. I offer in evidence the document identified by the witness. (Copy of proceedings of the Second Constitutional Convention of the Iowa-Nebraska States Industrial Union Council, August 25, 26, 27, 1939, Omaha, Nebr., was received in evidence, marked "Exhibit No. 1376," and follows.) Mr. VOGT. I assume that is a correct transcript of the speech that I made. Mr. MURDOCK. Have you looked it over, Mr. Vogt, to know whether it substantially gives and reports the speech that you made? Mr. VOGT. No; I haven't looked it over. Mr. MURDOCK. Well, I suggest that you do that before you identify it as your speech. Mr. TOLAND. Read it over. Mr. VOGT. Yes; I think it contains substantially the remarks that I made. That first paragraph is a pat on the back to make at any speech to any convention. When I talked to the A. F. of L., I patted them on the back, too. Mr. MURDOCK. Was the speech made at a C. I. O. convention? Mr. TOLAND. Now, Mr. Mr. MURDOCK (interposing). Your statement is that if you were addressing an A. F. of L. convention that you'd probably preface your remarks by some commendatory statement to them? Mr. VOGT. In fact, I did when I talked at the A. F. of L. convention at Dubuque. Mr. MURDOCK. That is kind of a common thing for a speaker to do, Mr. Vogt? Mr. VOGT. It usually is. Mr. REILLY. I read from Exhibit No. 1376, which is the proceedings of the Second Constitutional Convention, Iowa-Nebraska States Industrial Union Council, August 25, 26, 27, 1939, Omaha, Nebr. ADDRESS BY HERBERT J. VOGT One of the things that has amazed all of those who are interested in labor and labor movement has been the rapid and phenomenal growth of the Congress of Industrial Organization in the past two years. From nothing to over four million members strong. Unions throughout the country will have to build themselves a home against the threatening storm of economic winters. In the face of the approaching bitter winter cold of reaction, you may be complimented upon building such a fine shelter for your members now and in the future. But in these times, it will take |