A. Well, I have seen better bank sand than that.

Q. Do you know whether this Lemont lime is as good as the Alton, or lime in other parts of the country?

A. I do not know.

By Mr. FULLER;

Q. Do you consider those walls materially injured by the frost?

A. I do not; except there may be a portion of two walls there that is materially injured. The top of all of them is, perhaps, injured to a certain extent. I found perhaps three walls that are injured down near the bottom-walls that run east and west, right under the arch. They have been tampered with a good deal. The mortar seems to have been washed out more than in any other portion of the walls. Those walls are injured, but I do not think they are materially injured in any other place.

Q. Are there not walls there that should be taken down?

A. No, sir, I think not; except those I have spoken of, and, perhaps about three courses off the tops of the walls. That would be the extent of all that it would be necessary to rebuild.

Q. You think the mortar is good, and all that is necessary to make it adhesive to the brick is time to dry?

Q. Do you think, sir, it would be safe to erect walls to the hight of forty or fifty feet upon those walls as they now stand?

A. I do, sir. I don't think the walls are materially injured. Those places I spoke of are in such a position that there will be no weight upon them. The arches take it off.

SYKES WATKINS.

JOHN M. VAN OSDEL, examined by Mr. McMillan, on behalf of the Commissioners, in answer to a summons by telegraph from C. A. Roberts, Chairman of Committee on Investigation of State House:

Q. State your name, age, residence and occupation.

A. My name is John M. Van Osdel; my age is fifty-nine years; my residence is Chicago; my occupation is an architect. Q. State what experience you have had as an architect, and what experience as a builder?

A. I have been engaged in building for forty years, and as an architect since 1845-twenty-five years.

Q. State whether or not you have examined the work upon the new capitol building at this place, and if you state that you have, give as concisely as you can the result of that examination.

A. I have examined the work to-day. I examined the mason work of the new State House and find the work well done. The brick are of good quality. The mortar used in the brick-work is, in some places, of quick lime and in other places of water lime. I have no hesitation in saying that the mortar of both kinds is of good quality, and will, in proper time, form a hard cement, which it has already done when the circumstances have been favorable. A small proportion of the walls have been injured by exposure to storms before the mortar had sufficient time to set, and the fact that the bricks were saturated with water before they were laid, and the liquid mortar or grouting being poured upon every course after it was laid, completely saturated the walls with water, and on this account the mortar set very slow, and, therefore, gave opportunity for the storms to affect the joints. The mortar cannot harden until it dries, and many of the walls, on account of their great thickness are yet very damp, consequently the mortar in such walls, although it has set, is still damp and comparatively soft, but will harden as the wall dries and not before. A few courses of the tops of some of the walls will require to be removed. In other places the frost has scaled off the mortar joint, which may be pointed up on account of appearance but does no harm otherwise.

The cut-stone work is well done and has been handled with great care. The joint in the rustic at top or bottom is immaterial. I would prefer it at the bottom, as the joint would be hid from view. The walls interior and exterior have been kept in line with great care, and I have examined the work with much pleasure and satisfaction. The long time required to dry the walls will be of benefit to them, as the cement will be firmer on that account.

Q. State whether or not you removed any mortar from the joints in the brick-work and examined it with respect to its quality?

A. I did, sir, in a great many places.

Q. State whether or not you found that mortar satisfactory with respect to quality?

A. I found the mortar, where it had opportunity to dry, a very fine cement.

Q. How was it on the interior of the wall, inward from the outer surface?

A. Improving in some places. I found it was soft and damp. Q. State whether or not that will improve with age and become set?

A. As soon as the mortar can be dried it will carbonize and become harder each year for twenty years.

Q. State whether or not you gave to the examination of the mortar sufficient attention to say emphatically that the mortar used in these brick walls is generally of good quality?

A. I am very fully satisfied from my examination, which was very thorough, that it is of excellent quality.

Q. State whether or not you examined the sand on the State House grounds or any sand used in making this mortar, and if so what you found its quality to be?

A. I examined several piles of sand around the State House : which I found to be of very good quality.

2. State whether or not it is sharp sand?

A. It is sharp sand.

Q. State whether or not you examined the lime that was used in mixing the mortar?

A. I had no opportunity of examining the lime.

Q. Do you know the Lemont lime?

A. No, sir, I am not familiar with it. I only judge from the mortar that I saw and examined that it must have been good lime.

Q. State whether or not the walls, in their present condition. in that building, are of sufficient strength to justify their continuation upward some forty or fifty feet, as is contemplated in the completion of the new State House?

A. The principal walls—yes, sir. There are some of the interior walls where a few courses will have to be taken off the top where the joints have been destroyed by the action of the weather?

Q. State whether or not it will be necessary to remove any of those walls entirely, or any portion of them except a few courses on top?

I think I stated that only a few courses on the top would have to be removed from the top downward.

Vol. I-102

2. Something has been said about the walls beneath the large openings upon each side of the corridor. State whether or not it is necessary that these walls should be of the best masonry?

A. I should think the damage to that part of the wall would have no effect upon the strength of the building at all. They appear to be dwarf walls. I don't know what they are for. They might as well have been wood as brick. They give no additional strength to the building, and if taken down would have no effect upon the building.

Q. You spoke awhile ago of the rustic joints, saying you would prefer to have the joints upon the lower surface of the rustic. State now particularly why you would so prefer it?

A. My attention was called to the rustic joints, some of the joints being at the top and some at the bottom. It makes no dif ference whether they are upon the top or bottom. I would prefer to have them at the bottom because they could not be seen there. Q. Is there any reason why the joints should be more favored in these rustics than at other places in the building?

A. There might be less reason because the joint in the rustic is partly protected by the projecting stone above.

Q. State whether or not those stone have been properly cut in all respects, and well set so far as you examined them?

A. I examined that part of the work, the setting, very critically. I think I never saw a building set more perfectly in line both in perpendicular and lineal.

Q. Are the joints in the stone work sufficiently close?

A. They are very close and very perfect.

Q. Something has been said with reference to wooden wedges being placed in parts of the stone wall. State whether the plac ing of those wedges or strips was necessary, and if necessary, what purpose they subserved?

A. It is very often done in setting stone to allow the mortar joints to set, otherwise the stone would drop and press the mortar out. The wedges do no damage whatever. They are taken ont after the mortar hardens.

Q. Are the joints in that stone work, so far as you have examined it, good, perfect joints?

A. Yes, sir, I was very much pleased with the joint work. I don't remember a defect that I saw in any part of the stone work.

Q. Will the brick walls in that building support the superstructure necessary for the completion of the building?

A. I have no doubt of it, sir, to any reasonable hight.

By Mr. FULLER?

Q. You spoke of the walls remaining wet and every course being grouted, state if you examined the walls to see that for yourself, or whether it is a matter of information?

A. It is by information. I saw evidences of the grouting upon the side of the wall also.

Q. With reference to the building of brick walls of this kind, is it prudent to build walls of that character during the winter time in this climate?

A. I should prefer to build them in summer or fall.

Q. Do you think those walls have been injured by the weather?

A. Not materially, sir.

By Mr. MCMILLAN :

Q. Will it be necessary to remove any of the brick work form. ing the backing to the stone work?

A. I don't think I saw any defect in the backing of the cut stone work?

By Mr. WEBB :

Q. State whether or not those walls inside are not in a better condition for plastering on now than if they were pointed up? A. I don't think that makes much difference.

Q. Does not the plastering fill up the points in place of point

Q. Please state your name, age and place of residence.

A. Thomas W. Brady, 45 years of age, and live at St. Louis.