that the High Bailiff being before the Lord North ftrenuously and forcibly con- The Mafter of the Rolls, moved "That the High Bailiff be permitted to authenticate the lift of bad votes obtruded upon the poll, which lifts were mentioned and alluded to, in the evidence of Mr. Atkinfon." Lord North moved an amendment upon the motion, to leave out the words "authenticate the lift of bad votes, &c." and infert," that the lifts of bad votes obtruded upon the poll of Mr. Fox, were delivered to him, previous to the clofe of the poll, which lifts, he was affured, by credible evidence, were authentic." His Lordship obferved, that this amendment went to the very point, that the High Bailiff wanted to eftablifh, without bearing that odious colour of prejudging the merits of the election, when, in fact, the only bufinefs before the Houfe, was an enquiry into the conduct of the returning officer. The Lord Advocate of Scotland got upon his legs. He stated the important bufinefs before the House to be, firft, a petition from Mr. Fox, complaining of the conduct of the High Bailiff, in not returning him and Lord Hood; fecondly, a petition of a certain number of electors, in the intereft of Mr. Fox, complaining, that they were not reprefented in the great Council of the nation; and, thirdly, a petition from a certain number of electors in the intereft of Sir Cecil Wray, ftating the unfair and illegal practices ufed at the clection, and that in order to correct the poll, the High Bailiff had granted a ferutiny, which ferutiny the petitioners pray ed, might be permitted to go on, fo that a legal and just return of Members might be made. On each of these heads, he very learnedly difcanted, and urged his arguments, that the returning officer could not pollibly juftify himfelf, in having delayed the return, without fhewing at the fame time, the number of bad votes, which he had been credibly informed, had been obtruded upon the pol!; and this could be done in no other way, than to call evidence to authenticate thofe lifts, delivered to him for that purpose, and upon the credit of which he had granted the fcrutiny. He placed this argument in feveral ftrong points of view, and therefore the learned Advocate was against the amendment, and in favour of the original quetion. Lord Mulgrave obferved, that although he for one, verily believed, that there was too much truth in the report of foul and corrupt practices being ufed at the election complained of, yet he could not, in confcience agree to prejudge any one vote, much lefs feveral large lifts of voters, when it was very evident, that the High Bailiff could juftify himself, without adducing fuch proof; for that reason, if the noble Lord in the blue ribband would agree to another amendment of his amendment, to add after the words "authentic,” "which perfons were competent to give fuch evidence," he would fupport the noble Lord's amendment. This, faid his Lordship, went to an entire extenuation of the High Bailiff, if that officer could bring any fuch proof, and if admitted, he fhould certainly vote for the queftion in its amended ftate. Lord North immediately acceded to the propofition, and the Houfe feemed to accept of it cordially, when The Chancellor of the Exchequer apologifed for fpeaking thus late in the bufinefs, but he was by no means for fhackling the evidence, that if this amendment paffed, it would be conftrued into a general rule, continually hanging over the House, and would moft probable be fet up against every fpecies of evidence, however neceffary to be brought forth, in order to illuftrate the enquiry; and thereby in a great meafure, tend to defeat the intentions of the Houfe. He was not very preffing upon the fubject, but he apprehended, that if the common rule of evidence was reforted to, it would be fully fufficient to answer every purpose upon the prefent occafion. Mr. Fox faid, he trembled for the fate of his caufe when he clearly faw fuch an evident intention of prejudicing the minds of men not only in that House, but the nation at large. He proved to a demonftration, that fuch evidence was wholly unneceffary, that it was calculated only to imprefs an unjuft idea of the meafures pur fued fued by him and his friends in the like bufinefs, that it was a new and unheard of fpecies of oppreffion that a man fhould be condemned before the matter was fairly in iffue, in a court where he could not poffibly have it in his power to refift the charges, however wicked or malevolent, in order to fix a ftigma upon his conduct throughout the kingdom. That if the Houfe did allow fuch evidence, he muft, he would claim the juftice of the Houfe, that he might have time to answer fuch charges against his voters; that the House might in that cafe be justly charged with the delay and not him. Under pretence of acquitting the Returning Officer, he and his friends must be held up in a criminal light to the whole world, and after four or five years, the Committee might ultimately decide that the charges were falfe, wicked and unjuft: this he faid was not the fort of fatisfaction due to him, his friends and conftituents; therefore he did not claim but demand the juftice of the House. He faid that whatever might be the violence of certain perfons against him, yet that the House for its own honour its own dignity, its own juftice, muft adopt the amendment, or give him fufficient time to anfwer any particular on general charges. Mr. Martin faid, that as an elector of Westminster, and a steady friend to Parliamentrary Reprefention, he wifhed to fay a few words on this question:-that he thought every man in this country ought so be reprefented, and that it was a very ferious matter that fuch a City as that of Weftminster fhould be deprived of its rights, but that furely it might be a greater grievance to have a falfe reprefentation forced upon that City than to wait a fhort time for the real objects of its choice. He heartily wished to have this matter brought to an iffue as fpeedily as might be. If it could be decided during this feffion by a Committee chofen according to Mr. Grenville's Act, he fhould prefer that judicature to any other; but if (as he apprehended) fuch a Committee could not fit pon it during this feffion, in that cafe he should wish that an immediate fcrutiny might take place, that whatever fcandalous tricks had been practifed on either or both fides might be forthwith brought to light, and expofed to the deteftation of mankind; that if the High Bailiff fhould at partially or any way improperly du ring fuch fcrutiny, he would be amenable to the Bar of the Houfe to answer for his conduct, and that it were to be hoped Immediately the Counsel were called in, and informed by the Speaker, that evidence was to be examined refpecting the authenticity of the lifts of bad votes delivered to the High Bailiff. Mr. Affleck was called to the Bar, in the course of whofe narrative (for it could not be called evidence) he informed the House that he had been twenty days traversing the 70 out of 74 lanes ftreets, &c, in the united parishes. That he had discovered 143 bad votes for Mr. Fox; that there were lifts of those bad votes, but he had but one of thofe lifts in his poffeffion, which he delivered into the House, but which, although it was in his own hand writing, yet he had not examined into the truth of it himself; but that another Clerk gave him the copy, that fome times he attended this inquiry refpecting the bad votes, in company with the parish officers, at other times by himself; that he had attended at Wood's Hotel to examine the lifts: firft he faid to examine by the poll books, afterwards by a cheque book, and he be lieved one of the original poll books. In this loofe, vague, and inconclufive way, the evidence proceded, until Mr. Douglas put a stop to him, by objecting to the whole of his evidence, as being utterly il legal and incompetent. After a very diffultory converfation between the law members, it was agreed that the whole of this evidence, fhould be expunged from the books, and a memorandum written at the bottom of the Clerk's book, that the evidence was incompetent and illegal; and the witnefs had his lift returned to him. The Chancellor of the Exchequer moved to adjourn; which after fome oppofition from Mr. Fox and his friends was at length carried it being then three o'clock. The Houfe adjourned to Monday next. the Supreme Court of Judicature in Bengal, who had been ordered home in confequence of a refolution of that Houfe, was arrived in London. Mr. Pitt faid, he had hoped to have fignified that circumftance in prefence of the Hon. Gentleman who had moved the refolution, but notwithftanding that Gentleman was abfent, he thought it his duty to give the Houfe immediate notice of the fact. WESTMINSTER ELECTION. The order of the day was read for proceeding in the confideration of the feveral Petitions in progrefs of hearing on the fubject of the late Weftminster election, and the Counfel were called to the bar. Three witnesses were examined on the part of the High Bailiff, and one on the part of Mr. Fox. The queftions put to them went principally with refpect to the lifts of bad votes for Mr. Fox, ftated to have been delivered in to the High Bailiff and his deputy, by Sir Cecil Wray and his friends. During the examination of Mr. Grojan, the Deputy Bailiff, Mr. Erskine afked the witnefs, whether information had been given to Mr. Fox or his agents, of fuch lifts having been delivered in to the High Bailiff and himself, as he had stated?" Mr. Grojan in reply faid, "Mr. Fox's agents knew of them." Mr. Erfkine upon this, afked, "how the witnefs was affured that the perfons to whom he alluded, as knowing of the lifts of bad votes, were Mr. Fox's agents?" Mr. Grojan anfwered, "Because they appeared on the huftings as Mr. Fox's friends," and was proceeding to add other reafons, when M. Erskine, as it were, with an irrefiftible impulfe, interrupted the witnefs, by urging that "if all the friends of Mr. Fox were to be deemed his agents, almost every honeft man in the kingdom, out of that Houfe, might be confidered as his agent." Upon this, Sir James Johnstone rofe with great apparent warmth, and defired to know if the learned Counfel was to be permitted to abufe a witnefs under examination at their bar, with impunity? Counsel being ordered to withdraw, a warm debate, if it may be fo called, of a few minutes continuance, enfued. Sir James Erskine declared he had heard no abuse proceed from the learned Counfel his honourable relation, and defired the Hon. Member would ftate what it was, that the learned Counfel had faid, which could juf tify fuch a charge? Sir James Johnstone faid, he would not be the man to flinch from any affertion of his, or to defert the ground that he had VOL. VI. June 1784. once taken. He defired, therefore, that the Counfel might be called in to repeat what he had faid. A murmur ran through the House, as if this would be highly improper. Mr. Rolle faid, the fault lay with the Speaker; if he would exert himself properly in the chair, and do his duty, the House would proceed with much greater difpatch. When he gave his vote for seating the prefent Speaker a fecond time, he declared he did it under an idea, that the Speaker would keep that Houfe in order. If this had been done, they would not have seen the Right Hon. Gentleman on the oppofite fide of the Houfe, rise and speak in his own cause fo often, contrary to their known rules and orders. He called upon the Chair to know, whether it was not highly diforderly for a Counfel at the bar, or even for a member of the Houfe, to interrupt a witness in the middle of his answer to a question, that had been regularly put to him? The Speaker faid, it certainly was extremely diforderly, either for a Member or Counfel, fo to interrupt a witnefs, but in the prefent cafe, he really had not heard what had been faid by the Counsel, or he fhould have told him his interruption was diforderly. The Chancellor of the Exchequer endeavoured to put an end to the debate, by ftating, that whatever the Counfel had faid, he did not conceive it was faid with any ill intention, and poffibly it might be part of his instructions for him to act in the manner in which he had acted; be that matter as it might, he hoped the Houfe would not lofe another moment upon fo frivolous a topic, but would indulge the Counfel by overlooking what was paft, and calling them to the bar. The Counsel were called in, and the examination proceeded. At length, having got through the evidence on both fides, Mr. Wa fon was called on to reply upon the whole of the cafe, which he proceeded to do about half after nine. The learned Counfel went into ait the particulars of the cafe, and arged very ably in cxtenuation of his client, for about an hour. He concluded with requesting the indulgence of the Houfe, that his client might be permitted to read his own defence in perfon. The High Bailiff was called to the bar, and delivered from a paper a well digested fpeech, which he called the reafons that operated upon his mind to grant the scrutiny. It flated, that there were 10,000 votes given in the courfe Iii of of the first ten days. That in Vandeput and Trentham's election, there were only nine thousand two hundred and odd votes, and in the prefent inftance twelve thoufand two hundred and odd.-That there could not be fuch an increafe, confidering the operation of Mr. Crew's bill.-That Mr. Fox threatened a fcrutiny when he was in a minority, &c. &c. After the Bailiff withdrew, Lord Maitland moved, that the "High Bailiff be afked by the Speaker whether he had any objection to laying his fpeech on the table for the perufal of the members." Mr. Sheridan feconded the motion. This was warmly oppofed, and negatived without a divifion. Mr. Erfkine was then heard on behalf of Mr. Fox, for two hours and a half, and at half past two o'clock the Houfe adjourned to next day. iffued for a burgefs to ferve for that borough. The motion paffed, and the writ was ordered. WESTMINSTER ELECTION. As foon as the order of the day was called for, and read, Mr. Welbore Ellis rofe and faid, that fo much legal knowledge and erudition had been difplayed by the Counfel who attended the bar on this bufinefs, that it would not be requifite, nor indeed becoming in him, to enter on that part of the queftion; but as it involved matter of great conftitutional import, it certainly came within his province, as a man long converfant in Parliamentary bufinefs, to speak the fuggeftions of experience, and the language of Parliament, as well as reafon. Mr. Ellis then took a very extenfive and comprehenfive view of the Petition now before the House, the principles on which it was founded, and the defence of the High Bailiff of Westminster; and concluded with the following motion: "That it appearing to this Houfe that "Thomas Corbett, Efq. High Bailiff of the "Liberty of the City of Westminster, "having received a precept from the She"riffs of Middlefex, for electing two Ci"tizens to ferve in Parliament for the faid "City; and having taken and finally closed "the poll on the 17th day of May laft, "being the day next before the day of the "return of the faid writ, he now forth "66 with directed to make return of his precept, and of Members chofen in puriuance thereof." Mr. Anftruther feconded the motion, obferving, that the freedom of our conftitution was materially affected by the decifion of the butinefs; that if the reprefentation within those walls was to be fet afide by the caprice, whim, or affectation of confcientious fcruple in a returning officer, the difadvantages were as obvious as injurious. From the High Bailiff's clofing the poll on the 17th of May, it was evident he conceived himself fun&us offcio; and if fo, how could he, confiftent with his duty, attempt a fubfequent proceeding under authority of that very writ from which he derived his power; and his clofing the poll at the time he did, evinces his conviction of its expiration. His reafons, at leaft fuch as he alledged for granting a fcrutiny, were totally infufficient. In his defence witnelfes were called, with a defign to prove that a lift of bad votes for Mr. Fox had been given him by the friends of Sir Cecil Wray, though no wit nef nefs was brought to establish the incompetence of thefe voters, or to juftify the lifts. How eafy then would it be, on any occafion, to prefent a returning officer lifts of votes fuppofed to be bad, and how detrimental, if, in confequence of fuch unauthenticated information, he should be justified in difobeying the injunction of that writ, the iffuing of which was one of the most effential prerogatives vefted in the Crown. That previous to the 10th and 11th of William III. by an act of the 23d of Henry VI. the duty of a returning officer was fpecifically fixed and afcertained; fubfequent mifconduct and mal-practices of returning officers made it neceffary farther to bind them to their duty, by an oath appointed for them, by the 2d of Geo. II. by holding before them, as means of preventing mal-practices, the guilt of perjury. He further remarked, that the citizens of Westminster, well aware that taxes were to be levied, of which they must pay a large proportion, were naturally anxious that they should, for that purpose, be reprefented, as well as cities and boroughs infinitely more inconfiderable :-Befides thefe, Mr. Anftruther ufed many other very strong arguments in defence of the motion of his honourable friend. Lord Mulgrave, in a very long and excellent fpeech, took the oppofite ground, and combated with much fuccefs the motion and the principles on which it was founded; he expected, he said, when he found the honourable mover and feconder of the motion fet out with a mention of conftitutional arguments, to find them advance reafoning founded on the common law, or the law of Parliament; he declared that however his reafon might revolt againft, or his feelings oppofe any thing unfair or unjuft, ftill, if by ingenuity or management, if by intrigue or manoeuvre, any measure was proved to be founded in law, he would, for one fupport it, fince the inflexibility of law ought to be proved and fubmitted to on all occafions. He would fuffer gentlemen to avail themselves of taking advantage of the law, and let it be afterwards amended, to prevent future grievances. God forbid he fhould ever oppose what was founded on conftitutional principles; but happily, on this occafion, he need not make this facrifice. The impartiality, fairness, firmnefs, and conftancy of the High Bailiff, were obvious to every perfon who attended the bufinefs, and witneffed the reading of his manly and fatisfactory defence. In the courfe of the poll, he proved himself incapable of being warped from a just line of conduct; he would not be flattered or cajoled into measures on the one hand, nor bullied on the other; the circumftance of the numerous polling the first days, when little enquiry was made, rendered impofition easy, and the frequent detections in fubfequent stages when enquiry was more ftrict, left it no way to be doubted, but advantage had been taken of the neglect of enquiry in the beginning: his Lordship adverting to many points in the defence of the High Bailiff, fhewed that the moft cogent motives prefled him to grant a fcrutiny, both to fatisfy his own confcience and to deal impartial juftice. After many legal arguments, in which he introduced an act of the 8th of William III. which the legislature had before them in the much talked of ftatute of the 10th and 11th, which act he argued as exculpatory of the High Bailiff; to the objection made for the electors of Weftminfter, refpecting taxation and representation being infeparable, he would certainly allow it, though not in the fenfe they wished. The electors of Westminster too were compofed of people from all parts of the kingdom, and had not that contracted idea of reprefentation which fome gentlemen wished to attach to them: of this they gave a very fignal proof in electing Lord Rodney in the career of his victories, when his profeffion led him to other brilliant fervices to his country out of thofe walls; and it happened unfortunately for the gentleman cried up by his friends as the favorite candidate, that the noble candidate, confeffed by all parties to be the favorite candidate, and whofe attachment to that Hon. Gentleman, could not fuffer him to fhare his favours, was of fuch a profeffion, and of fuch eminence in that profeffion, as rendered him liable to be called out on active real fervices, nor will his conftituents complain of his abfence from Parliament, while he honours them with victories. His Lordship said, a return as member for Westminster was now confidered almost in the light of a naval honour. He concluded by oppofing the motion, after a variety of forcible and excellent reasoning. The Lord Advocate of Scotland followed Lord Mulgrave, obferving, that the method adopted in this country for conducting elections, muft be always productive of inconveniencies: in that part of the kingdom with which he was beft acquainted, he muft fay, with due deference to this country, that elections were much better conducted, fo, indeed, as to preclude the neceflity for a fcrutiny; no man being adI i2 mitted |