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that might derive to their party from pro-' him, but against him, it was not at all crastination, and at the same time to de- surprising that he should not be very
forprecate the natural imputation of delay. ward to bring on public businets, when With respect to a short mutiny bill, he he knew that he had not weight enough would not at this moment enter into that in the House to carry through the business question, which was not then regularly that he might have to propofc. For these · betore the Hởuse; but he would reinark, reasons he would excuse both sides of the that if a short bill should be sent up to House of iotentional delay; the one because the Lords, it would not appear very fur- they had not delayed business ; the other prising to him, if the Lords should alter it because they knew they were not in'a fitu. so far as to bring it back to the standard ation to do any thing, except one which it of former mutiny bills. If then such an was their duty, and in their power to do, alteration should be made by the Lords, to retire from lituations which they know and the bill to altered should be returned they could not fill with advantage to the to the Commons, what would be the con- public. With respect to the motion then fequence, if the latter, adhering to their before the House, hs was not at all furprif. order, and the practice of their proceede ed that it was oppofed by the Right Hon. ings, should reject such a bill ? If such Gentleman ; for when he could not break an event was to take place long before the the majority that was against him, it was expiration of the present mutiny act, the natural enough that he should endeavour consequences might not be dangerous ; to degrade it, by making it adopt a manbut at present there was not day a to be loft, ner of acting, totally irreconcileable with But he would not for a moment suppote' confiftency. The Honse had already laid that the House would pafs a short mutiny it down iwice as a rule, not to proceed bill; he did not believe they would ; nay to any other business of importance, unhe would almoft venture to go so far as til the King's answer, which fo materialto say they would not. He was for ly affected the privileges of the House, had going into the bill this day, because there been previously taken into confideration. was not a moment to be loft. -If the He observed that it had been said that the adjournment moved by the Right Hon. King might by his prerogative kcep the Member Mould take place, he was sure army together even after the mutiny act that the consideration of the mutiny bill had expired : did those who maintained could not pollibly come on till Tuesday ; such a doctrine recollect the very first and as the consideration of the account clause in every mutiny act. " Whereas from the India-house stood for that day, standing army in time of peace withpoffibly it might not come on till Wedner « our content of parliament is contrary day. Surely then the Housc did not wish to to law," Could prerogative exercise a run the bill to a day, and to risk the con- power which had been declared by above sequences that must necessarily follow, if one hundred aĉts of parliament to be ifthe bill should by any misfortune happen legal ? Could a soldier's right as a citizen to miscarry. In order therefore to avert to be tried by his peers be taken away those consequences, as far as in hin lay, by any authority fhort of a poltive act of he would oppose the motion for adjourn- parliament or had ministers any right ing the committee on that bill.
or power to issue any sum voted by parLord North did not believe there was a liament, until the act appropriating that willing delay of public business on either fum fhould have paffed ? He reprobared fide of the Houte, and enumerated instan- the idea of the Lords altering the mu. ces in which both parties might be said to tiny bill and thereby occasioning a dehave occafioned delays, but observed that day, and declared his serious determina. it would not be an easy matter to convict lion char it should come on on Tuesday either party of being the cause of these next, at least he would vote for its being delays. With respect to the delay of the brought forward on that day. great measures of finance, and other im. Mr. Powys withed the motion might be portant business, it rested entirely with the carried for the sake of consistency, and in right hon. gentleman, becaute he had not order to consider the King's anfiver mayet so much as attempted to bring forward turely. That aufwer, he said, was an any part of it. But this delay he would answer indeed! He hoped therefore, not impute to him as matter of blame; they might be allowed a thort faule to because standing in a fituation, the like of ihed a tear over the expiring dignity of which no former minister had ever experi- the House of Commons." As to the inuenced, tanding with a majority not for tiny bill he was sure na dan had an intens
tion to refuse to pass it ; for what length upon the subjeét, and if the Lords made of time would be the question.
the smallest alteration in it, that House, Mr. Brook Watfon reprobated delay in he faid, ought to throw it out, let the strong terms, as in every point of view confequeuce be what it might, or their dangerous, and therefore he thould vote a. independence and importance were gone gainst the motion, the fole object of which for ever. He laughed at the aflcrtion appeared to him to be delay.
Jately made by a Crown Lawyer, " that Lord Surrey wished to be informed what it was the bounden duty of that House on tras the reason of the Hellian troops being its ailegiance to receive Tuch Minifters as kept here.
the King Thould appoint.” If that were The Secretary at Itar said the only rea. the case, the Crown might fav, fic vole,
that the Weser was entirely fic jubeo, and put the weakest and wickfrozeni, but ihat transports were in readi- edelt men on the Treasury Bench to be ness and they would put to Iça as soon as found in the kingdom. Every body knew, neivs should arrive that the frost was there were chose, whom perhaps it would broke up in that river. He complained be more agreeable for the Croivn to have that the question was uncandid, and tended on the Treasury Bench, than the Right to excite jealousy among the people.
Honourable Gentleman and those now Mr. Rigby exprelied his furprise near him, but the perfons, he alluded to, that a gentleman in office should com dared not face the day and become oftenfiplain, that a member of parliament, ble. That Hloufe he said, was competent ivhen the Mutiny Bill is under difcuffion to judge for itself, and might withhold asks a question relative to the disposition of its conhdence from any fer of Minifters it a large number of foreign troops at per- disliked. When he said this, he declared fent in the kingdom, and instead of a re he meant no difretpect to the Right Honfpe&ful answer, which he had a right to ourable Gentleman at the head of his Ma. Took for, he' is abuted for daring to do içsty's Ministry; he had the highest rehis duty, and enquire into a matter, re• fpe&t for him, but his manner of coming specting which, in the best of times, that in as a Minister was a sufficient ground for House had been more than ordinarily that House to withhold their confidence jealous. Had Mr. Onnow been in the from him. Mr. Rigby concluded a Chair, Mr. Rigby told the Speaker, he warm but most able speech with saying, would have marked with indignation a that he should certainly vote for a short
piece of conduct to indecent, and every. Mutiny Bill. way so improper. Having very properly and Lord Mulgrave replied to Mr. Rigby. very conftitutionally exprefied his disap. He reasoned ftrenuously against the late Probation of the Ansiver of the Secretary at proceedings, which had funk the chaWar, Mr. Rigby took notice of the ex racter of the House. That Houfe, he faid, traordinary do&trine that had been that would ever appear degraded and humiliday laid downí, chat the King could keep ated when it claimed privileges which
the army without a Mutiny Bill. He did not belong to it, or carried those prifaid, every soldier would be told he was vileges it did possess to an unconftitutional åt liberty the moment the prefent Mutiny extreme. He handled Mr. Powys with Bill expired, provided another Mutiny great severity. The gentleman reBill had not by that time passed, and he winded him of a mcınber of that defired to know how the armv, in that House, in the time, immediately antececafe, would be held zogether? What con. dent to the Protectorate, a person named Itable would billet them? What inn- Sir Benjamin Wright who the historians keeper would receive their horses into of thoferimes described as an able, honelti his Itables, or the men into his houle: and respectable man, (but fond of iceing What addressing Navors would order his name in print, and of pathag for å their quarters? Would the Grocers Coin- great speaker) whom a party made use of, pany take them into their hail? The' on account of his independence, and on position was not only the mof uncon account of his character, as their morioe ftitutional, but the inott, ridiculous and maker, conscious that what came though impracticable that ever was held. Jle him would be better received by the Houte, treated the idea of the Lords, (svhom tome than if the real leaders of the party had fool or other had, he understood, called the made the proprofitions themselves. At Hereditary Representatives of the People) that time as at this, the House was led on altering the Mutiny Bill with great dir- step by step, till it was brought to that dain. The mutiny Bill laid a heavy tax point, to which a little before they could
scarcely ever have thought it possible for HOUSE of COMMONS. them to have come, for who in the begin
Monday, March 8. ning of the proceedings of the long Par
The House went into a Committee on liament, would have believed that they would end in crearing Oliver Cromwell Mr. Nesbite's Divorce bill, Mr. Mastera Lord Protector ? His Lordship applied this
man in the chair. The council having historical remark to the proceedings of the gone through the evidence, withdrew. House at prefent ; he said, a Right Hon
Lord Surrey observed that an unprejuourable Gentleman had cajoled them into diced man mighe well have luspected that voting one resolution, and with that about the husband had really connived at the their necks he had led them on by de irregularities of the wife ; for it appeared grees, till he had got too far for any of that Mrs. Nesbit always lay in Mr. Nelthem to think of retrcating.
bit's bed, except when the gentleman who Mr. Marsham defended Mr. Powys.
was the partner of her guilt happened to He knew he acted from the di&tares of his pass the night in the same house with own judgınent and upon principles of them (See the evidence, February Madesire to serve his country; and that gazine, 2. 144.) He was, however, faneither he nor his honourable Friend were
tisfied that there was no collusion and that to be perfuaded or intimidated from do. Mr. Nefbit was entitled to a divorce. He ing what they conceived to be right. He found by the evidence, that his lady had was convinced that the constitucion was in
brought him 10,000 l. in money, and danger, and whenever that thould appear ihadow of justice that the should be de
500 l. a year in land. He could fee no to be the cafe, he should duty to use his best endeavours, at every prived of the estate that originally berisk to fave it from the destruction that longed to her, and yet the bill made for threatened. With regard to the question therefore moved to leave out the words
her a provision of only 2001. a year. He he meant to vote for it ; but if the Right Honourable Gentleman would bring for an annuity of 200 l. and all the rest of ward fuch measures as were necessary for the clause for the purpose of infirting the the fupport of publick credit, he would landed estate of sool. a year,” to which he
giving back to Mrs. Nesbitt her give him every assistance in his even where the measure did not meer his thought her entitled. wishes, he would not vote against it, fo
The motion not being seconded, dropthat the Right Honourable Gentlman's ped of course, and the bill being gone weakness thould become his strength.
through was ordered to be reported to the
House. Sir P. J. Clarke and General Conway said a few words in support of the motion. GALLERY CLEARED OF STRANGERS:
Commodore Johnstone spoke against it as The House being resumed. did also Sir William Dolben.
Sir James Lowther compained to the At half afrer eight the Houfe divided. For adjourning the mutiny bill 191
Speaker, that a friend and near relation of
the Member for St. Albans (Lord GrimAgainst it
fton) had been turned out of the House,
for want of room in the gallery ; a moMajority 9 At nine o'clock the House adjourned to Sir James and the Speaker, and it ended
mentary conversation took place between in Sir James's stating that seveal persons
had got into the gallery by improper HOUSE of LORD S.
means ; and therefore, as room could not
be found for a Member's friend, he would Monday, March 8.
move to enforce the standing order against
the admission of any stranger : the The Receipt Tax Bill was read a second Speaker instadtly ordered the ftrangers to time and committed.
withdraw ; and thus, near two hundred Lord Bathurst's morion respecting the persons, who had sat there from eleven in public accounts was, on account of the the morning till half after three, were obo indifpofition of the Lord Chancellor ado, liged to retire. journed to Monday next.
The order of the day being read for Several private bills were read. Ac taking his Majesty's answer into conghalf past four the House adjourned till tom deration. Dorrow.
Mr. Fox refa and said, he presumed it Vol. YI. April 1784.
would not be expected he should go over approbation of the end they fought, bur all the grounds on which he had been not explicitly promising his concurrence in acting in the present conteft ; the House the means, on which the House instantly well knew how he had been turned out came to a resolution, that he should be an of office, merely because he had been sup- enemy to his country, who thould advile ported by a large majority in that House, his Majesty to prosecute an offensive war in measures of the molt difficult and im- in America. Upon exactly fimilar ground portant nature ; his India bill had been the House of Coinmons, in the prefent inthrown out in the House of Lords by stance ought to be admitted as the best judges means of corruption, of the most da bosh of the means and of the end : and he ous and, groffest kind. He complained should be perfectly warranted by this heavily of the hardship of his situation. He precedent to move a resolution, that he argued that it was not good policy in any was an enemy to his country, who should country to subject minifters to the power advise his Majefty to continue his present of the crown ; if their study was to please administration ; by the earneft advice of the crown, then ministers it seemed were fome friends, however he did not mean to fafc; but if they dared to do their duty, propose such a refolution--what he should their own ruin was the certain consequence. move would not be an Address, but an It well becaine the House of Commons, humble Representation to his Majefty, for, therefore, not to suffer men to be dir to that no anfiver was customary, and he graced and forsaken who had been ftreitu- withed for no answer bocause nothing was ous in their duty.
so unfeemly, nothing could disgrace us As for the King's anfwer, he could not misre in the eyes of Europe and the world, have thought it possible for any Minister than to see the King of England and his to put into the mouth of Majefty fuch Parliament wrangting about words and contradictions and such fcandalous du- engaged in a controversy of fach a kind. plicity ; there were passages in it big He said he did not intend to stop the fupwith danger to the freedon of this consti- plies ; that the couuery was ruined, and tution he could not have believed that the completely undone, was most clear ; that Right Hon. Gentleman had to detested public credit could not land ; that our this conftitution, he could not have believe foreign concerns muft go toruin, he believed ed that he would have dared fo far to insult every man muß now see : those however the House of Commons as again to ask were responsible who had brought the for the reasons of their resolutions. Every country into this state of diftraction ; for beggar, in every arbitrary country, had a liis part, fo far from stopping the fupplies, right to petition his King, stating the rea- he Mould press minifters to bring forward fons of his petition : and this, "fòrfooth, the public business; he would bring on was the whole mighty privilege, that by his own amended India bill, but if it was that fpeech the King was advised to allow loft in the other House, ministers were the British House of Commons--the House bound to come forward with some netr of Commons had'ofren addressed, without plan for India ; and indeed every part ftating their realons. Hc then desired the of our public affairs cried aloud for their Clerk to read the Address in the case of instant attention. He then defended Mr. the American war, which desired his Ma- Powys and Mr. Marsham, from the jesty to put an end to an offenfive war on charges of inconfftency ; he faid they that Continent; as the withdrawing of could not abett ministers, for whom they the troops from thence would give us ad- profeffed even a predilection, in their retitvantage over the French in other quarters, ance to the House of Commons. Some there and would rend to conciliate the Ameria were who had agreed with him in the
Thus, he said, the House there outset of the dispute, but who (as appear: gave only a general reason, in the fame ed by the decrease of the majorities) had manner as in their late Address. The gone over to the side of Administration.House, in the one instance, had desired How to defend the confiftency of fuch the King to withdraw his troops, for the men was indeed difficult ; and it was forre sake of making peace with America : in 'comfort to find, that on examining the the present case, they desire the King to reasons of such deserters, it appeared that dismiss his Minifters, for the sake of those who had come over to him were men making an united and extended Admini. ercry, way respectable ; while those who Aration. It was true, that in the in: had left him, on the other hand, (as was ftance of the American War, the King naturally to be expected) were men of teturqed an answer declaring, indeed, his whole company and of shofe fociety no
man, he bcileved, was ever very am
this House, or whether it is all the world bitious.
befide, that have been deceived --We He concluded with moving his refolu are ever talking to one another within tion, (See last month's Magazine, pages thele walls about our dignity, but do the 163, 164, 165.)
people catch this strain from us? Have we
been able to make their blood run highs Lord Surrey feconded the motion. Mr. Dundas laid, the general principles jota falter on the subject of our dignity
does the circulation of their blood run one of the right honourable Gentleman, in this representation, w!rich he had moved, that our constituents, initead of catching
than it did before ? Nay, so far from it, were what no man living would deny: he from us this raging fever, have thought only lamented, that the right honourable
proper to apply their phlebotomy to our Gentleman dared not avow in this his manifesto to the world, (for suclı he con; during the height of our phrenzy. He
veins, in the hope of relieving us a little, lidered it) those principles which he and then recorted on Mr. Fox's argument, others had dared to avow in the course of that it was dangerous and impolitic in evetheir speeches. Why will he not, for inttance, instead of saying to his Ma- ry ftate, to trust ministers completely in
the arms of the Crown; urging that it jetty, " that this House has a right to de- would be ftill more dangerous should they clare their want of confidence in minifters ?” Why will he not infert, " that the depend on the Houte of Commons for Houfe claims a right of negativing his Ritution he observed lay between these two
nomination and support. The true conMajetty's appointment of ministers, with
extremes; the King has a right to name, out gising a lingle reason ?" This indeed and the House of Commons has aftermight alarm the country; this might not
wards, upon trial full riglit to accuse the suit the purpose of his manifesto, which
the Ministers if indeed, there is any thing he understood was meant rather as some
fo flagrant in the presons or characters of thing of the healing kind. But why send
Ministers, as to make the mind revolt at it to his Majesty, forbidding at the same their nomination, and to merit instant time any antwer? Why not publish it to
censure, no doubt the House of Coinmons the world, after the manner of other mani- ought instantly to interfere ; - but to lay feftos, with a becoming title? “Whercas, that this House has in all cases a negative this House is uuiversally supposed to have
on the appointment without giving one been committing lately the most danger reason why, is to fay that this Houte has ous and alarming outrages on the consti- the appointment ; for they gain all the tution of these realms : and whereas thou- end and all the effect of an actual nomina: sands of our faithful constituents have tion. The Righe Hon. Gentleman, had taken violent aların at our proceedings; been prudent enough to infert in his manibe it known, therefore, to all count.cs, festo, that it was not the punishment, but cities, and boroughs, that, &c.Sir, continued Mr. Dundas, this should be merely the removal of Ministers that he
wilhed: the world would at least give him the preamble of your manifesto ; and then
credit for that part of his declaration ; to counter declarations might be publilhed
get their places the world would readily against it, which would serve to bring the believe was all he wanted, and that he matter to a fair issue. Persons might then could give no realon why they ought to be sent through the country with it in the be turned out, and why he fhould come same manner as I understand they are
in, was what the world would also as now sent with pamphlets about secret in readily believe. He made fome obfervfluence, and the dignity of this Houfi, ations on Mr. Pite's honourable conduct and many
other subjects, of such an abs in the negotiations with the Duke of struse and difficult nature, that I confess I
Portland, and maintained, the answer fear few country people will comprehend from the King, fo far from being capable them. Nay, Sir, as I understand, noble of the charge of duplicity, was fair, manmen even, one personage in particular, a is, decided and explicit ; for how could · member of that reprobate House, which his Right Hon. Friend, as a man of honthe honourable Gentleman has been speaking of, is set out, as I am told, upon his pur, forbear from telling the King what
he so perfectly well knew himself, that travels, with such piles of pamphlets as
to turo him out, would not prove the are reckoned sufficient to open all the eyes
means of forming an union between the in this country:
But in truth, Sir, it is two contending parties. He hinted that high time to ask ourselves, whether.it is the meeting at the St. Alban's Tavern had